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Old 05-20-2017, 12:08 AM   #1
Mygul
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Join Date: May 2017
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Default Seeking Help Identifying Canadian Devils Brigade Members in Photo's

I am seeking some help in identifying members of the Devil's Brigade in photo's, they would be the Canadians, the two that I have identified... one is a famous person, the other is my grandfather... there is also the General Robert T. Frederick in the group photo.

My Grandfather passed a few years ago and have given me his military memories/ images/ sparse items.

I have applied for his service record in the USA as I have the Canadian one but it does not explain how some of the images came to be.

Anyways, I am looking to connect and understand more of his service time so I can complete compiling the information to submit to our local military history section.

Thank-you for any and all help!


Last edited by Mygul : 05-20-2017 at 12:46 AM. Reason: added image
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Old 05-20-2017, 01:51 AM   #2
Temujin
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Originally Posted by Mygul View Post
I am seeking some help in identifying members of the Devil's Brigade in photo's, they would be the Canadians, the two that I have identified... one is a famous person, the other is my grandfather... there is also the General Robert T. Frederick in the group photo.

My Grandfather passed a few years ago and have given me his military memories/ images/ sparse items.

I have applied for his service record in the USA as I have the Canadian one but it does not explain how some of the images came to be.

Anyways, I am looking to connect and understand more of his service time so I can complete compiling the information to submit to our local military history section.

Thank-you for any and all help!

I wondering if this photo was taken later than Aug 1944.

The FSSF at that time was:

On 14 August 1944, the 1st SSF landed on the islands of Port Cros and Îles d'Hyères during Operation Dragoon, the invasion of southern France. They fought the small Battle of Port Cros in which they captured the five forts on the islands from the German Army. Nine men were killed in action or died of wounds received in combat. On 22 August it was attached to the 1st Airborne Task Force, a provisional Seventh Army airborne division, and later made part of the Task Force. On 7 September it moved with the 1st Airborne Task Force to defensive positions on the Franco-Italian border

Also, all the men in this photo are dressed in Canadian Battle Dress, indicating they were no longer with the FSSF and I note a women in the middle of their group? I also note two men are wearing a Tam (highland unit head gear).

Just trying to figure out if this was taken "later' than Aug 1944, or the men had left the FSSF and were now with Canadian Units and were on leave in Paris??

Does your grandfather's records tell you when he joined and left the FSSF?, this may help identify the time frame of this photo...
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Old 05-20-2017, 01:32 PM   #3
Mygul
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Originally Posted by Temujin View Post
I wondering if this photo was taken later than Aug 1944.

The FSSF at that time was:

On 14 August 1944, the 1st SSF landed on the islands of Port Cros and Îles d'Hyères during Operation Dragoon, the invasion of southern France. They fought the small Battle of Port Cros in which they captured the five forts on the islands from the German Army. Nine men were killed in action or died of wounds received in combat. On 22 August it was attached to the 1st Airborne Task Force, a provisional Seventh Army airborne division, and later made part of the Task Force. On 7 September it moved with the 1st Airborne Task Force to defensive positions on the Franco-Italian border

Also, all the men in this photo are dressed in Canadian Battle Dress, indicating they were no longer with the FSSF and I note a women in the middle of their group? I also note two men are wearing a Tam (highland unit head gear).

Just trying to figure out if this was taken "later' than Aug 1944, or the men had left the FSSF and were now with Canadian Units and were on leave in Paris??

Does your grandfather's records tell you when he joined and left the FSSF?, this may help identify the time frame of this photo...
I know he served twice, once with the Scottish Essex and I have no data on his first service as I have applied for the record from the pentagon (apparently USA service records are not provided to Canada).

Pertaining to the image, I have no confirmed date, but can confirm he was in France via the liberation, thus the date I inserted as I can not obtain a date and time for Roberts's or Prince being in France at any other date.

To my understanding, the FSSF had a join mission with France Liberation in conjunction with the Dragoons (Scottish).

What I am confused about (as I keep trying to match time lines) is when and how he first joined, I have his Canadian service record but it is not a time-line match to some of his images.

I spoke with a Brigade historian who confirmed he was brigade and knew of his company.

I believe this pic below were brigade (graduating class?) as I can not obtain any data on my grandfather pre-1943. Perhaps you can elaborate. Prince is in this picture as well as my grandfather.

http://i1271.photobucket.com/albums/...89932208_o.jpg
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Old 05-20-2017, 05:09 PM   #4
Temujin
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I may be able to help if you wish to share his Canadian records. Help decipher the dates etc. I'll send you a PM.....

Secondly, you have to be prepared that his US Records may not be found, in the early 1970's they had a major fire at the facility that housed the paper records of US servicemen, and then lost millions of records. But you need to apply for they and see what they have.

Cheers
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Old 05-22-2017, 11:12 AM   #5
Temujin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mygul View Post
I am seeking some help in identifying members of the Devil's Brigade in photo's, they would be the Canadians, the two that I have identified... one is a famous person, the other is my grandfather... there is also the General Robert T. Frederick in the group photo.

My Grandfather passed a few years ago and have given me his military memories/ images/ sparse items.

I have applied for his service record in the USA as I have the Canadian one but it does not explain how some of the images came to be.

Anyways, I am looking to connect and understand more of his service time so I can complete compiling the information to submit to our local military history section.

Thank-you for any and all help!

A follow up on your information and the photo above. Just to confirm to you that the man you identified as Tommy Prince is NOT correct. This is not Tommy Prince. You can google his photo on line and see that it is not him.

Secondly, the "very old" man that you identified as General Fredrick, again is NOT correct, this is not him, so I would suggest you google his photo (in 1945) and you can see that this is not him. I would suggest that he may be a "tour guide", as the Canadian Army ran "tours" of Paris and other places for soldiers on leave in Europe.

A review of the records you sent me indicate that you grandfather did NOT serve in the First Special Service Force. His records indicate he served with the Royal Canadian Army Service Corps (RCASC) and late in the war he transferred to the RCIC (Royal Canadian Infantry Corps) and served with the Rocky Mountain Rangers, the Essex Scottish Regiment and then finally with the Royal Winnipeg Rifles. He served with the RWR as part of the Canadian Army Occupation Force.

Here's a copy of the Infantry Units that were part of the CAOF.....you can see in his records that they say he was posted to the 4 Royal Winnipeg Rifles, which were part of the CAOF



The last unit, Royal Winnipeg Rifles, where also known as "The Little Black Devils".......this is NOT affiliated with the First Speccial Service Force.

You may have other records that confirm his service, but from what you sent to me he did not serve with the FSSF

Let us know if you need any other assistance or have any other questions.

Cheers

Last edited by Temujin : 05-22-2017 at 11:21 AM.
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